The ingenuity of the American service member never fails to amaze me. For those of you who don’t understand what they are looking at, those are twin M-3 Grease Guns mounted gunship-mode in a US Army O-1 Bird Dog observation aircraft during the Southeast Asia Wargames.
Not sure how effective it would be, but definitely cool and I always admire the ingenuity and can-do spirit of our Soldiers.
If you ain’t cheatin’ you ain’t tryin’
May not be accurate at altitude but a very effective psychological weapon.
I wonder if they were looking back through a history book and saw something about the Italian aircraft-mounted Villar-Perosa twin 9mm SMGs?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Villar-Perosa_aircraft_submachine_gun
I don’t think so, that’s far too obscure of a weapon and mounting platform. I think it’s more like the dual .30 caliber browning setups that were popular in aviation. Or from Vickers dual K guns on the SAS jeeps in North Africa. Those options would have taken up too much space and weight for a plane this small.
It’s not a bad idea though, given the history of NVA taking guns up in their planes and just fighting through the windows like here. Badass.
https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intelligence/csi-publications/csi-studies/studies/vol52no2/iac/an-air-combat-first.html
Definite proof SSD needs “Like” button.
I like it 🙂
Great example of American ingenuity.
The Air Force required they be removed.
Great example of American bureaucracy.
What was the AF’s excuse? That they’ll draw enemy fire?
The AF felt that arming Army fixed wing aircraft was encroaching on their territory.
It goes back to the Key West Agreement.
key west agreement, whats that ?
It’s what divides up roles and mission between the services.
http://cgsc.cdmhost.com/utils/getfile/collection/p4013coll11/id/729/filename/730.pdf
The Air Force traditionally blocks the Army (from whence it came) in all new employments of power from the air as that is their interpretation of the Key West agreement, an agreement, not a law that describes in general the roles of each service.
Vietnam ushered in widespread use of rotary aircraft by the Army and was blocked at every step by the Air Force who cited the Key West agreement. E.G. first the Air Force limited the size of helicopters, then wanted all helicopters, then wanted to approve Army helicopters, blocked the arming of helicopters. They even tried to procure the AH56 Cheyenne attack helicopter because it had stubby wings and a pusher prop.
To stop Air Force interference and gain independence of action when it came to helicopters the Army sacrificed arming O-1 observation aircraft and gave up its intratheatre light transport plane the Caribou.
(sometimes the Air Force flew the exact same observation aircraft doing a similar mission with HE rockets vs. the Army’s marker rounds because of this madness)
Air Force cultural insecurity causes it to interfere with Army efforts to develop most if not all tactical solutions to combat that require solutions from the air. The C123 and drones are two recent examples of that with different results. Army fears of a congressional showdown and the potential of unintended consequences causes it not to pursue issues in its interest e.g. transferring the A10. The branch partisan dance of musical chairs continues where traditionally the grunt is the one left standing…
I remember seeing a similar picture many years ago of an Air Force 0-1 FAC with an M-60 mounted across the rear cabin, barrel pointed out the window straight port/aircraft left. Guess the pilot could’ve used it while in a high bank left turn.
Like the fact that they put muzzle flash supressors on them. Looks like a swivel arrangement for a back seat guy…..
My first thought was how was changing mags out in flight?
Spooky’s little brother, Kinda Scary.
“Kinda Scary!” You win the Internet!!!
Subgunship 🙂
What is Vietnamese for “Curse you, Red Baron!”?
So much win…
I have seen twin mount mp5 in some low budget movie.
this is so fucking awesome… “how can you shoot the women and children? easy…ya just don’t lead them as much!”
As everyone knows, you just can’t .45 ACP when it comes to a nice, flat trajectory.
Yeah, but you’re shooting from above. From ABOVE.
If those two M3s are fixed they would be pointing almost straight down if the pilot is flying a two minute circle 1000 ft over target. I do not see any remote firing mechanism on the triggers. If loaded with all tracers, short bursts could be used as spotting rounds to guide in the bombers and CAS.
My dad (call sign Pterodactyl 34) flew O-1 Bird Dogs during two tours in Vietnam. I showed him this article and this was his response:
Can’t wait to shoot the left wing strut off. Fixed M-79s aimed towards the rear would be more effective. I know of what I speak. Brass is easier to pick up and does not jam the rudder and elevator cables. Rear aiming to a point about 30 degrees behind the wing. The 40mm round curves into the relative wind in an arc that is very predictable – kind of like slow pitch softball. Since the USAF has never taught pylon turns, they do not understand the concept of pivotal altitude. Only old Spooky pilots and Army Aviators get it.
Reminds me of the submachine gun Darren McGavin used in The Challenge.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7EvPvA5qGM