We were contacted yesterday by Ares Armor front man Dimiti Karras regarding an issue that has begun to come to the forefront of 2A rights. Although drawn in by ATF actions against one of Ares’ suppliers, they are now at the center of it. Not only is the story swirling the blogosphere, it’s also made its way to the evening news.
The story revolves around polymer 80% lower receivers for AR15-style rifles. These are considered non-guns are and consequently do not have serial numbers. They are purchased by those who wish to finish the work at home and so long as they do the work themselves for their own use, it is perfectly legal and the resulting firearm will not have a serial number. In some people’s eyes, this makes them even more evil than the standard evil that is a black rifle.
Reportedly, the BATFE raided California-based EP Armory last week due to a determination letter that had deemed EP’s 80% Polymer lower to be a firearm – the determination letter was quickly found to be factually incorrect, and the BATFE was alerted to this. Despite this, the BATFE still obtained warrants against EP Armory, and earlier this week also threatened to raid Ares Armor, who sells these 80% lowers, based on incorrect information. It must be mentioned the ATF has allowed EP Armory to go back to business.
Ares Armor’s lawyers contacted the ATF and they requested a list of every customer that had purchased an EP Armory polymer lower from Ares Armor and for them to turn over the remaining polymer lower inventory that they have in lieu of the threatened raid. Ares is willing to turn over the 80% lower receivers but they draw the line at giving up the information on customers they maintain have done nothing wrong. In response, Ares Armor has managed to obtain a Temporary Restraining Order against the BATFE issued by the United States district court of Southern California. That’s a new one on me. I can’t of anyone who’s ever done that before. The ATF has yet to respond to the order and both parties may end up in front of a federal judge later this month in order to determine if the restraining order has merit.
Update: Here is a scan of the official order issued by the United States District Court of the Southern District of California, separated into two parts.
Dmitri has some big brass ones.
This is really frightening. My buddy has a 80% lower on his desk quite literally as a paperweight because it’s really cool and a great conversation starter for some. Also in his business, it’s simply an example of injection molding that he shows for fun. He actually has no desire of machining it. Too bad for him if this goes the wrong way. They’ll say he simply has intent.
Dmitri has a new customer: me.
Well done, Dimitri. Now is time for all of us to stand up for our rights.
batfe run out of guns to gift wrap for the cartels?
They’re busy gargling their balls.
@Palehorse
You win the posts.
First of all, extreme respect to Aries for standing their ground. They’ve gained a customer today.
I was going to make a message of support on my company’s Facebook page and, even though everyone here would agree this is bullshit and Dimitri did the right thing, Im not supposed to discuss political issues on their FB.
That said what’s happening here is bullshit and Dimitri has taken a stand that means something tonall of us. He could have rolled an no one would have been the wiser and he would have had much less hassle and many less legal fees. As it stands I’m going to refer every customer I can’t service with on-hand product to Aries.
The thing that surprises me out of all of this (definitely not the part about the BATFE overstepping their bounds) is that they didn’t go after poly80.com with all of their “So easy Obama could do it” ads. Too obvious, maybe?
Apparently, they just sell lower parts kits…
I had to check the websites of Aries, the BATFE, and Poly80 to see wo you were talking about, but I see that all Poly80 has up now is LPKs. When I posted last night, and when I was looking for info on this subject during the day, Poly80 was business as usual. I guess they are catching the same hell. I wonder if they folded and gave their customer list over when they took the polymer lowers off their site…
Yeah, its interesting at how fast those came down. I wasn’t aware of them till I saw your comment, but sometimes news doesn’t move as fast as you might want it to.
Just stick with selling the tactical machining’s 7075 forged 80’s. Those polymer 80’s are what the ATF has a problem with. And I see why, the polymer lowers are pre-made “complete” lowers with resin filled in the fire control pocket.
Read before you spread mis-truths that may be believed by others that didn’t bother to read.
No kidding, that is exactly the false premise that BATFE was going by. You should be ashamed of yourself for spreading misinformation.
Do you work for the BATFE? This bad info is what they based their warrants on.
if you own or have held one of these polymer lowers you can clearly see that the outer part is molded over the inner- meaning, there never was anything “filled” . The core was made and then the rest molded (from liquid polymer) around it. A hollowed out lower never existed.
What’s your company name so I know to never purchase anything from you.
Power move dmitri!
Take political action and email / call your representatives and voice concern about this abuse of power by BATFE. Also contact the White House who sanctioned abuse. Your voice / vote is a powerful thing in politics, use it.
Good to see the little man standing up against the big man. Hope that Dmitri gets all the support he and his staff need at this time.
Alex & Team
Intelligent Armour Ltd
While I think it is good that they are not bending over to the ATF, this doesn’t appear to be a legal restraining order. This looks like a petition for one at best as it is on the company letterhead, without a judges signature or clerk of courts notary/seal. Normally courts have what is a standardized application that you have to feel out so this may be the letter they attached with their petition. Im not sure what state he is in but its nothing more than a letter saying “I want you to stop intimidating me” in the southern states. On top of that, it is not often that you can get a state court to give you any kind of court order against a federal agency (you may recall federal agencies can only be sued im federal court and not state court). Best of luck to them.
To add to my comment above, the U.S. Marshals Service normally serves all federal court documents which I am sure know where to locate the ATF so I am perplexed why the respondent hasn’t “responded” or perhaps they have not been served by USMS yet. This makes me think there may be some behind the scenes head scratching on how a temporary order would have granted in the first place because the petitioner is essentially alleging by naming the ATF, that the entire ATF is going to do something illegal to harm him and the Judge has to have a reasonable belief that thus based on fact in order to grant it. I’m wondering now if someone slipped up… This will be interesting to keep up with.
There are court records showing that the restraining order was granted and is signed by a district court judge.
Ok, this is where the demise of RIF is a real problem for society. That and some serious civics classes. I have been told that the restraining order was granted by US District Court. That’s federal and that’s what the article says. Unfortunately, I do not have a copy of the court’s actual order but rather the petition.
We’ve added the actual court documents. It’s real.
Sorry for once I didnt read the whole article before commenting. So the RIF comment was deserved but the civics comment was adding insult to injury… Bad mood?
they’ve pulled the poly lowers from the website.
If this legal mess is cleared up, I’m buying an 80% lower to use as a paperweight just to show my support.
Said this on another site but, the BATFE only acts like thugs and nazis when Democrats are President, it’s long overdue to have this unneeded department dissolved and most of the current leadership brought up on charges