Don’t get too worked up, but I saw this…
Yep, Beyond Level 9 pants in Kryptek Highlander.
Tags: ADS, Beyond, Kryptek, Warrior Expo
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If only they had Crye’s permission haha.
Any time there’s a post about military clothing, some tard has to make a post directly accusing or eluding to copy right infringement of CP designs.
It’s about as funny as the incessant “frag hazard” posts that inundate any post about a piece of equipment made out of metal or plastic that’s carried on the body.
Everyone is a critic nowadays. Funny thing is that there are always multiple sources for soldier systems and clothing is one of those such items. The majority of the time, this is due to a manufacturers capacity to make the required quantities.
Here is a brief insight into Beyond’s L9 uniform: https://ssdaily.tempurl.host/2009/09/03/beyond-tactical-level-9/
There is another article circulating somewhere regarding the user trial, but I could not find it in my hasty search.
There are only so many ways one can make a pair of cargo pants…
Why do they need Crye’s permission to manufacture these?
What permission do they need from Crye?
Never seen Cryes pants on any patent documents. Seen combat shirts and other products but not combat pants.
Seen Beyond, LBX, Patagonia, Propper, Massif use elements thereof but never exact.
I have tried crye and i have beyond pants and are different pants
There’s a patent for the kneepad and how it interfaces with the pant.
Looks to me like that pair of pants I accidentally poured bleach on when I put them in the washing machine.
The lighting was a little odd on that one wasn’t it?
Maybe when we get into the next war fighting reptilian skinned lizard aliens this camo will be the obvious choice. Until then I think its novelty garbage for airsofters designed by helicopter pilots with ZERO time in the bush. And didn’t Beyond do SHOT show with Orion Design Group with a bunch of their patterns why are they suddenly promoting Kraptek?
Please, go on. I’d love to hear your full diatribe on why Beyond isn’t supposed to offer more than one camo pattern. And, while you’re on a roll, please give us your in-depth insight on other camouflage designers with “ZERO time in the bush.” You know, folks like Caleb Crye and Guy Cramer.
Or PenCott too while we’re at it…
I wasn’t sure if Dom had served.
haha you tell em SSD
Beyond can make clothing out of what ever camo they choose. If they want to jump on the kraptek band wagon like everyone else in this industry go for it. I just find it strange that they co-hosted beyond shot with ODG. Now roughly 2 months later they are promoting a different camo, it doesn’t make sense to me. As far as “time in the bush” you’re right, its not a pre-requisite to designing good camo, but after listening to Guy ramble on about fractile geometry, blah blah and watching crye release recolored multi cam and of all things a breaching shotgun? Lets just say it was very refreshing talking to the ODG guys at the beyond shot party and listening to their passion for design with real life experience to back it up.
I’ll make sure to tell Brian Bishop to stop all work on anything non-camo!
Does your camo designer even operate, bro?
The world is full of individuals/companies that have convinced consumers they are the the best at what they produce. Even if those companies have no real world experience in their respected field. The idiot savants of industry can and will fool people into believing in such products for awhile, i.e. Opti-fade. Until someone brings a product to market that reveals these shortcomings the populous will continue to purchase them.
Optifade was designed to work against animal vision so they would see through the pattern and not perceive a threat: https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=635218659983&id=127553880524&_rdr
Listen to this man. On another note, capitalism and all that. Consumer beware… or educated. Giver if it works for you where you’re at.
Ok, I had to laugh at that.
I have worked with Lt. Col. Timothy R. O’Neill, Ph.D. (U.S. Army, Ret.) since 2004. Tim is a 25-year career as an officer in the United States Army, including two years of combat in Vietnam and 15 years as a member of the tenured faculty at West Point. Colonel O’Neill commanded tank and armored cavalry units, and served on squadron and brigade staffs. He was a member of the permanent faculty of the Department of Behavioral Sciences and Leadership at the U. S. Military Academy from 1976 to 1991…http://one-six-one.fifthinfantrydivision.com/idone.htm
Boy that stirred up some shit and all over a pair of trousers!
Guy, not sure why you felt obligated to post Tim O”Neil’s resume, He has a super solid military background but I’m pretty sure I didn’t see Ungulate eye ball scientist anywhere on there and has he ever killed an ungulate with a bow? Does he even hunt? There was a reason Sitka (Gore) dumped that marketing platform “The science of nothing” because it was all hype and no actual science on how ungulates actually see. Sitka makes awesome hunting clothing but that pattern for what ever reason doesn’t work, its the ACU of the hunting world. We used it and tested it for two seasons it was the inspiration for the two years of research that led us to design our patterns.
Correction I meant UCP not ACU.
I listed Col. O’Neill’s background as people were asking about combat experience. W.L.Gore has not dropped the Science of Nothing and Optifade Open Country is doing very well in the industry. The third member of the design team is Dr. Jay Neitz
Profile
Ph.D. in Biopsychology, University of California, Santa Barbara
Vision Scientist, Medical College of Wisconsin (1991-2008, during the development of GORE™ OPTIFADE™ Concealment)
Vision Scientist, University of Washington Medical School in Seattle (current)
Role
Ensured that GORE™ OPTIFADE™ Concealment patterns were scientifically accurate
Used his research on animal vision – including color vision, field of vision and acuity – to judge how effective GORE™ OPTIFADE™ Concealment patterns would be in the field
A Few Words
We can measure in animals anything you can measure in a human being and be every bit as accurate.”
Dr. Jay Neitz
http://www.optifade.com/hunting-gear/content/partners-dr-jay-neitz.html
You may want to watch the videos on Optifade to see what roles each of us played in the development: http://www.hyperstealth.com/Optifade/
This is exactly what I’m alluding too. You have “scientific” research that’s been done in a lab but until you actually perform tests in the field, which we have done exclusivelyfor close to 2 years, you can’t prove that research. Let’s also not forget that regardless of Lt. Col. O’Neil’s esteemed military background he is responsible for the UCP pattern as well as Opti-fade. Which goes to show that regardless of your knowledge with enough marketing power (Gore-tex) you can convince consumers your product is gold even if the interior is filled with excrement.
All I see here are a bunch of names with PHD this and PHD That. Education is great but experience is much more valuable.
Do any of you who designed this pattern hunt? Have you ever killed an ungulate with bow Guy? Have you ever stalked an elk at 10,000 ft and gotten close enough to touch it? So close you can smell his breath?
The links you provided the videos have been removed from the site, not that it matters because I watched and bought in on all the hype when it was released. If the art of nothing is still in use why is there no trace of it on the Sitka site? And FYI Open country (Optifade) coined as “Opti-fail” by hunters hasn’t been selling well. Sitka only holds 6% of the hunting clothing market. If it was designed to deceive all ungulates based on how their vision works then why did they launch a forrest pattern? Why the need to add green? Deer are ungulates last time I checked so why do you need a different pattern to hunt them? Maybe it’s because they can see certain colors and maybe you would have known that to begin with if you and your team of esteemed PHD’s were experienced hunters with years of stalking and hunting ungulates.
I don’t consider myself any type of camouflage expert nor do I have a PHD. I just have decades of experience hunting four legged and two legged critters of all shapes and sizes I know what works and what doesn’t based on a tacit knowledge of the prey I stalk not because we photoshopped something cool or because a science book or a PHD says so.
This exactly what I’m alluding too. You have scientific research you have conducted in a lab but until you actually perform tests in the field, which we have done with Opti-fade exclusively for the better part of two years, you can’t prove such research. Let’s also not forget the regardless of Lt. Col. O’Neils esteemed military background he was responsible for the UCP pattern (untested before fielding) as well as Opti-fade. Which goes to show that regardless of your knowledge with enough marketing power (Gore-tex) you can convince consumers your product is gold, even if the interior is filled with excrement.
Lt. Col. O’Neill had nothing to do with UCP. He was involved in MARPAT for the USMC and the Army recolored MARPAT to come up with UCP but not with his involvement.
OR you could just NOT BUY the camo you don’t like and/or doesn’t seem to work!
ODG,
While I can’t confirm your number of 6% of the hunting market for Optifade, if true, this is actually a huge number, I would need to know the tally for all hunting camouflage sales before confirmation – but I know it’s a big market.
I know exactly how Optifade is selling and it has from the start surpassed all of W.L.Gore’s expectations.
In developing the patterns we worked very closely with Dr. Jay Neitz, the animal vision expert, to come up with the most accurate filters to duplicate how the deer see the environment, given that deer are dichromatic, special attention was taken to determine their Blue and Yellow visual spectrum, we also included contrast sensitivity and their visual blurriness. Once you duplicate how the ungulate perceives their environment, and find the neutral zone of colors within their spectrum of vision which appear as neither blue or yellow to the ungulate, only then can you design a pattern to fool them.
To a human, the Optifade Open Country and Optifade Forest patterns do not look correct as we see Trichromatic (we see in Red, Green and Blue), but we didn’t design these patterns to counter human viewing.
Why add green you ask, because specific hues of green take on a specific yellow/brown coloration to the dichromatic, not all variations of green looks the same to a dichromatic. One of my close friends has a similar type of dichromatic color blindness and can attest to this.
Many hunters are unaware of this effect so we use Green in the pattern instead of the Yellow/Brown equivalent hue as it looks identical either way to the ungulate.
The Optifade Forest pattern (the one with green in it) is designed for tree stand hunting so the pattern must flow vertical to disrupt the human in a background that is primarily vertical. The contrast is different than the Optifade Open Country due to the angle that the ungulates would be viewing the trees. The hue of green duplicates the yellow/brown colors they perceive on leaves during the Spring/Summer and Fall.
There are more Optifade hunting patterns coming.
8 of 10 ungulates agree that those are cool looking pants.
I’d rather see Beyond pants in stock than in Kryptek.
You can get Beyond pants. Contact them to order.
These results from the lab tests on US4CES and Multicam (OCP) show the big change in NIR results if you test on or around the full moon.
https://www.facebook.com/185325401505637/photos/pb.185325401505637.-2207520000.1394321645./645674772137362/?type=3&theater